Friend of a Friend (FOAF) IRC Chat Logs for 2004-02-11

00:24:12 <edd> foafbot, edd's name

00:24:18 <foafbot> edd's name is Edd Dumbill, according to Dave Beckett, Edd Dumbill, James Hendler, Jason Bell, Schuyler Erle; and anonymous sources

00:24:34 <edd> foafbot, James Hendler's urls

00:24:35 <foafbot> http://norman.walsh.name/foaf, referred by Anon198 from http://swordfish.rdfweb.org/discovery/2001/08/codepict/scutterplan.rdf [Spidered OK.]

00:24:42 <edd> Uh, right.

00:24:52 <edd> foafbot, James Hendler's name

00:24:53 <foafbot> James Hendler's name is James Hendler, according to anonymous source

00:24:53 <foafbot> James Hendler's name is Jim Hendler, according to Dave Beckett; and anonymous sources

00:24:53 <foafbot> James Hendler's name is Norman Walsh, according to James Hendler, Morten Frederiksen; and anonymous sources

00:24:53 <foafbot> James Hendler's name is Norm Walsh, according to Dave Beckett; and anonymous source

00:25:17 <edd> so something smushed badly there.

00:26:05 <edd> i['ll remember not to use jim as an example in the demo

00:26:13 <edd> foafbot, danbri's name

00:26:17 <foafbot> danbri's name is Dan Brickley , according to anonymous source

00:26:17 <foafbot> danbri's name is Dan Brickley, according to Dave Beckett, James Hendler, Morten Frederiksen; and anonymous sources

00:26:18 <foafbot> danbri's name is Daniel Brickley, according to anonymous source

00:26:18 <foafbot> danbri's name is , according to anonymous source

00:26:18 <foafbot> danbri's name is J. R. "Bob" Dobbs, according to anonymous source

01:41:35 <dajobe> I'm so proud, #joitiojoitiojoitio bumped my chair

01:41:44 <zool> lol

01:41:58 * zool awards dajobe some whiffie

01:42:29 * dajobe wonders if that means i orkut:friend of him now

01:42:50 * crschmidt whuffie zool.

01:42:58 <zool> so apparently tribe is planning on releasing data in foaf come march

01:43:13 <zool> or so the rumour mill instructs me

01:45:30 * edd bumps into dajobe's chair

01:45:53 <dajobe> *ouch*

01:46:09 * dajobe beats edd's new shiny laptop with his p800

01:47:22 <zool> the bastards got a tr1mp hasnt he

01:47:30 <zool> he hasnt even dared show me his tr1mp

01:47:33 <dajobe> yeah

01:47:42 <dajobe> apple laptops are *so* last year

01:47:43 <zool> for fear of my poundingly jealous reaction

01:47:49 <zool> yay

01:48:22 <crschmidt> LJ FOAF code should go into cvs tonight or tomorrow.

01:48:52 <zool> neat

01:49:07 <kasei> crschmidt++

01:49:08 <crschmidt> Soon there will be a source of 2 milliion+ foaf files!

01:49:11 <crschmidt> mwahaha.

01:49:48 <zool> we had to handle the big data challenge eventually, it might as well be asap ;)

01:50:35 <crschmidt> I also included a nice searching utility, so lj.com/multisearch.bml?q=crschmid@uiuc.edu&type=email&output=foaf redirects to a foaf file.

01:50:58 * crschmidt should make a list of the search methods for you people before it goes live.

01:52:02 <edd> zool: where are you?

01:52:16 <edd> zool: i'll gladly fl@5h mY tr1mp at you

01:53:28 <wkearney_lap> wkearney_lap is now known as wkearney99

01:55:42 <danbri> LJ FOAF: coolness!

01:56:00 <danbri> crschmidt, got a sample file for last minute sanity check?

01:56:06 <crschmidt> uh, i can. one second.

01:56:27 <crschmidt> The code won't go live for a week or two anyway, so we can check it after it's in cvs, too.

01:57:03 <danbri> yup. for those who don't know LJ intimately, its definitely easier to check sample output than try to figure out what the code will emit...

01:57:07 <danbri> is there a dev/staging server?

01:57:52 <crschmidt>http://goathack.livejournal.org:8023/~crschmidt/data/foaf

01:57:59 <crschmidt>http://goathack.livejournal.org:8023/~community/data/foaf

01:58:14 <crschmidt> First is an example of a foaf:person, second a foaf:group

02:01:01 <danbri> thanks. looking.

02:01:02 <danbri> xml:lang="en"

02:01:13 <danbri> is there a language setting? or lj assumes en users?

02:01:21 * danbri starting at the top...

02:01:31 <crschmidt> Right now, there isn't anything that they can have in there that wouldn't be non-en.

02:01:40 <danbri> ok

02:01:52 <danbri> <foaf:name>crschmidt</foaf:name>

02:01:54 <crschmidt> There is an lj language selection, which will get added in.

02:01:58 <danbri> is that a username, nickname etc?

02:02:10 <crschmidt> username, yeah.

02:02:10 <danbri> we have <foaf:nick>... which could be more appropriate

02:02:32 * wkearney99 hates the anglo-centric "assume it's english" when there are 6B people on the globe and they ain't talkin english...

02:03:00 <crschmidt> We don't have real "name" support on LiveJournal - is it better to use <foaf:nick> and no <foaf:name> or use a username as <foaf:name>?

02:04:25 <crschmidt> wkearney99, I have a bunch of international developers (Denmark, Saudi Arabia, and Germany) who breath down my neck every time I do that, so don't worry too much about it staying like that ;)

02:04:43 <danbri> <foaf:interest rdf:resource="http://goathack.livejournal.org:8023/interests.bml?int=women" dc:title="women" /> :)

02:05:03 <danbri> use nick if they're usernames/nicknames

02:05:07 <crschmidt> okay.

02:05:15 <danbri> i think it will be instructive to have 1+M foaf files without foaf:name

02:05:24 <danbri> many japanese foaf files only use nicks

02:05:44 <danbri> it is an aspect of online persona malarky...

02:06:15 <crschmidt> *nod*

02:06:22 <crschmidt> alright, I'll make that change.

02:18:56 * edd gets dashboard actually running again, yay

02:20:39 <danbri> me back sorry

02:21:25 * edd undersands free beer around

02:21:28 * edd goes off to see

02:21:46 <danbri> ok the foaf:Group think looks ok, we've never really seen a lot of use of that bit of FOAF so it should get some debate going

02:22:53 <dajobe> b..e..e..r

02:28:52 <Unknown> Unknown is now known as Netminder

03:08:48 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as netmoo

03:09:24 <netmoo> netmoo is now known as Netmonkey

03:18:13 <Netmonkey> Netmonkey is now known as Netminder

03:27:15 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as Netminder

06:13:49 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as NetCafe

06:31:05 <NetCafe> NetCafe is now known as Netminder

07:35:22 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as Netminder

07:58:42 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as Netminder

09:53:19 * ldodds plays with flickr.com

09:54:11 <ldodds> YASN site, although better than Orkut IMO.

09:54:56 <libby> oh pictures. neat

09:55:14 <ldodds> Unlike Orkut they claim no copyright on stuff you upload, and will be encouraging CC licensing for public stuff

09:55:29 <libby> that's neat

09:55:33 <libby> chatrooms?

09:55:37 <ldodds> they're also a simple services interface: flickr.com/services

09:55:56 <ldodds> groups, and chatrooms

09:56:07 <libby> neat

09:56:08 <ldodds> there's an upload photo my email option

09:56:13 <ldodds> s/my/by

09:56:32 <libby> looks interesting. I've got to run into work in a minute bah

09:57:06 <ldodds> mini-review here: http://erikbenson.com/index.cgi?node=flickr

09:57:18 <libby> a

09:57:20 <libby> ta

10:08:04 <libby> !pic erik benson

10:08:11 <wh4> Erik Benson http://www.erikbenson.com/images/big-hair-portrait.jpg

10:08:12 <wh4> Erik Benson http://www.erikbenson.com/images/big-hair-portrait.jpg

10:21:13 <ldodds> the flickr profile could easily be converted to FOAF if they wanted to: first/las name gender, homepage, IM properties, email, even 3 letter Airport code!

10:22:18 <ldodds> flickr developers are at EtCon I see, the virtual worlds/MMOG/REST presentation

10:22:29 * ldodds thinks danbri should go and nag then for FOAF export :)

11:25:43 <libby> oh definitely leigh

11:26:45 <libby> gosh that is big hair in erik's picture

12:19:52 * Jibbler sighs at the unadventurousness of http://marnanel.org/county/1/g0800yg000pwI000

12:22:22 <ldodds> counties you've visited?

12:22:34 <Jibbler> yeah

12:22:48 <Jibbler> actually, i've missed a few out

12:22:51 <Jibbler> oops

12:23:27 <Jibbler> my memory is poor :)

12:26:01 <ldodds> IIRC: http://marnanel.org/county/1/N540K80gHN14Z000

12:27:33 <ldodds> actually, thats more like it: http://marnanel.org/county/1/N540K80MTN14,000

12:27:51 <ldodds> my world map is pretty poorly populated though

12:31:22 <libby>http://marnanel.org/county/1/hMcITy0g2kp4,000

12:31:29 <libby> kinda cool

15:22:25 <_KrAmEr__> hello

15:22:38 <bryce> hi

15:23:05 <_KrAmEr__> can i ask xslt related questions in here?

15:27:51 <_KrAmEr__> nm

16:00:59 <libby> nick!

16:01:09 <libby> looks like I'll be in london on friday afer all

16:01:16 <libby> so you see, I do like you

16:01:21 * nmg struggles with a new mozilla nightly

16:01:29 * nmg w00ts

17:00:06 <grault> grault is now known as earle

17:00:10 <earle> afternoon all

17:00:54 * earle has a question of ontological preference.

17:02:51 <libby> heya earle

17:02:55 * earle waves

17:03:21 <earle> It's that time of year when I give my FOAF file a good frobbing. And in doing so, I've come to feel indecisive about defining some things - I can use http://xmlns.com/wordnet/1.6/, or alternatively http://opencyc.sourceforge.net/daml/cyc.daml . Do people have a preference, and if so, why?

17:03:59 <earle> Actually, maybe I could define in terms of wn: and have a seeAlso for the cyc definition...

17:04:16 <libby> there's also wn 1.7 etc I guess

17:04:28 <earle> oh? man, I *have* been out of the loop recently.

17:04:54 <earle> It doesn't seem to be in xmlns.com/wordnet/ ...

17:05:16 <libby> no sorry

17:05:18 * earle has been reading about predicate logic recently and has got all excited about RDF again.

17:05:20 <libby> there isn;t :)

17:05:24 <earle> oh :)

17:05:29 <libby> there shoudl be

17:05:32 <libby> or something

17:05:38 <earle> ponder

17:05:42 <libby> anyway, not sure about your oprig question

17:05:46 <libby> riginal

17:05:55 * libby can;t type

17:06:09 <earle> cyc has some handy definitions like "SubwayStation"

17:06:13 <libby> maybe peopel are using more wordnet because it's easier to access parts of it

17:06:16 <earle> right

17:06:28 <libby> !wn subwaystation

17:06:29 <wh4> no results found, sorry

17:06:33 <libby> !wn subway_station

17:06:34 <wh4> a terminal where subways load and unload passengers

17:07:13 <libby> I'd use wordnet, but that's just a personal preference. I've seen cyc mostly used for handy verbs like 'near'

17:08:07 <earle> oh, I didn't realise wn had constructs like that

17:08:42 <libby> actually wn is amazing. I installed it and it's so amazing

17:08:43 * libby gushes

17:09:00 <earle> another reason I like cyc is it has some bizarre things in it...

17:09:00 <earle> <daml:Class rdf:ID="AbradingSomething">

17:09:01 <earle> <rdfs:label>abrading events</rdfs:label>

17:09:01 <earle> <rdfs:comment>A collection of events. In an #$AbradingSomething

17:09:01 <earle> event, the surface of some object is gradually worn away by

17:09:03 <earle> scraping or similar physical contact involving friction.

17:09:06 <earle> Devices used in elements of #$AbradingSomething include

17:09:08 <earle> files and sand paper; elements of #$AbradingSomething would

17:09:11 <earle> include the event in which Howard Hughes sanded down the

17:09:13 <earle> Spruce Goose for the last time, the event in which Lucy

17:09:16 <earle> Ricardo filed her fingernails just before her singing debut

17:09:18 <earle> at Rickie&apos;s club, etc.</rdfs:comment>

17:09:21 <earle> like, er, sure

17:09:28 <libby> danbri's service just grabs the nouns but it has verbs and other parts of speech etc. and thesaurus-like things

17:09:31 <libby> heheh

17:09:34 <libby> !wn ice

17:09:34 <earle> aye

17:09:35 <wh4> water frozen in the solid state; "Americans like ice in their drinks"

17:09:38 <earle> :)

17:09:44 <libby> I love that definition.

17:09:45 <earle> !wn beer

17:09:46 <wh4> a general name for alcoholic beverages made by fermenting a cereal (or mixture of cereals) flavored with hops

17:09:49 <earle> bah

17:10:17 <ldodds> !wn fruitbat

17:10:17 <wh4> no results found, sorry

17:10:23 * earle decides to switch to wn but keep the xmlns:cyc, just in case

17:10:28 <earle> !wn fruity

17:10:29 <wh4> no results found, sorry

17:10:49 <ldodds> !wn dolphin

17:10:51 <wh4> large slender food and game fish widely distributed in warm seas (especially around Hawaii)

17:10:55 <libby> !wn fruit_bat

17:10:56 <wh4> large Old World bat of warm and tropical regions that feeds on fruit

17:10:58 <libby> fish!

17:11:02 * ldodds grins

17:11:03 <libby> I'm shocked

17:11:14 <libby> 'game fish' bizzare

17:11:20 <libby> !wn whale

17:11:21 <wh4> a very large person; impressive in size or qualities

17:11:23 <ldodds> !wn dolphin-2

17:11:24 <wh4> any of various small toothed whales with a beaklike snout; larger than porpoises

17:11:30 <libby> heheh

17:11:36 <libby> !wn whale-2

17:11:37 <wh4> any of the larger cetacean mammals having a streamlined body and breathing through a blowhole on the head

17:11:48 <libby> see that would be whale-1 for me

17:11:55 <libby> and dolphin-1

17:12:08 <ldodds> !wn seal

17:12:09 <wh4> fastener consisting of a resinous composition that is plastic when warm; used for sealing documents and parcels and letters

17:12:14 <ldodds> !wn seal-2

17:12:14 <wh4> a device incised to make an impression; used to secure a closing or to authenticate documents

17:12:20 <ldodds> !wn seal-3

17:12:21 <wh4> the pelt or fur (especially the underfur) of a seal; "a coat of seal"

17:12:35 * ldodds concludes wn is politically incorrect

17:12:39 <libby> it's sea mammals day at foaf!

17:12:43 <ldodds> dolphins for food, seals for the fur!

17:12:49 <libby> geez

17:12:52 <bryce> also see mortenf's foaf explorer interface to wordnet: http://xml.mfd-consult.dk/foaf/explorer/?foaf=http%3A%2F%2Fxmlns.com%2Fwordnet%2F1.6%2FBeer

17:12:54 <libby> ice for drinks

17:13:00 <libby> consume those resources!

17:13:10 <libby> yeah that's neat

17:14:28 * earle learns a new word

17:14:36 <earle> "dysphemism". neat.

17:14:51 <bryce> wn! dysphemism

17:14:52 <earle> I guess that's like an antonym, but meaner.

17:15:02 <earle> !wn dysphemism

17:15:03 <bryce> !wn dysphemism

17:15:05 <wh4> an offensive or disparaging expression that is substituted for an inoffensive one; "his favorite dysphemism was to ask for axle grease when he wanted butter"

17:15:06 <earle> oop

17:15:06 <wh4> an offensive or disparaging expression that is substituted for an inoffensive one; "his favorite dysphemism was to ask for axle grease when he wanted butter"

17:15:35 <earle> !wn building

17:15:37 <wh4> a structure that has a roof and walls and stands more or less permanently in one place; "there was a three-story building on the corner"; "it was an imposing edifice"

17:16:23 <ldodds> see, I'm surprised that didn't return "a structure that one places over rain-forests to make handy dry places for eating dolphins" :)

17:17:51 <earle> nah, I like the cyc definition better... "Examples include the Empire

17:17:51 <earle> State Building, Michael Jackson&apos;s house in L.A., King

17:17:51 <earle> Arthur&apos;s castle, an #$AircraftHangar at O&apos;Hare, a

17:17:51 <earle> #$Lighthouse in the Mediterranean sea, the

17:17:52 <earle> #$SydneyOperaHouse, the #$WashingtonMonumentInWashingtonDC, etc."

17:18:10 <earle> nice selection.

17:20:05 * earle wonders why wn:Airport has three different versions of JFK airport hardcoded in

17:22:26 <libby> !

17:22:51 * libby lols at ldodds

17:27:41 * earle wishes inkel's language spec had a definition of "speaks $language like a schoolkid"

17:28:37 * ldodds waves bye

18:04:06 * earle -> off

18:04:08 <earle> earle is now known as grault

18:46:12 <bryce> bryce is now known as bryce_lunch

19:27:37 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as Netminder

20:11:57 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as Netminder

20:39:39 <dajobe> "I just heard from Paul Martino, the CTO and Founder of Tribe.net, that they were working on FOAF and RSS support for Tribe"

20:39:49 <dajobe> -- http://joi.ito.com/archives/2004/02/12/tribe_to_support_foaf_and_rss.html

20:40:14 <dajobe> in other news google/blogger drops rss1.0 for atom

20:59:30 <CaptSolo> dajobe: good news :)

21:24:19 <danbri> what was that new foaf-based aggregator?

21:24:22 <danbri> Z-something?

21:25:25 <xavier> aggregator as in for RSS feeds?

21:25:30 <danbri> foaf stuff

21:25:49 <bryce_lunch> zopto?

21:26:35 <danbri> ta

21:26:59 <bryce_lunch> be sure and snag the wallpaper while you're there. :)

21:30:26 <peepo> Dan, did you get my email?

21:31:57 <danbri> peepo=jonathan c?

21:32:10 <peepo> Yup

21:32:11 <danbri> yep just saw it. haven't time to process anything for a few hours, am prepping for a talk

21:32:15 <danbri> hi though :)

21:32:22 <peepo> no problem

21:32:31 <danbri> thanks

21:32:53 <danbri> if i dont reply, come grab me here next week sometime when i'm back on uk timezones

21:33:02 <danbri> does it need urgent reply?

21:39:35 <CaptSolo> zopto is another one of social networks?

21:40:17 <bryce_lunch> yes. very primitive so far, but it *does* use foaf.

21:40:32 <bryce_lunch> bryce_lunch is now known as bryce

21:40:47 <peepo> well I had hoped Jim might come to a conference on Friday week

21:40:55 <peepo> but can't raise him on email

21:41:25 <peepo> keep getting "520" must have been something I ate

21:41:47 <danbri> :) haven't talked to him for a bit

21:42:04 <danbri> bryce, is zopto yours?

21:42:24 * danbri re-reads, assuming not

21:44:32 <peepo> nite

21:49:20 <bryce> no, danbri. but mortenf, sbp, and i signed up as alpha testers.

21:54:10 <CaptSolo> bryce: as dajobe wrote earier, seems like Tribe.net is working on foaf support too

21:54:35 <bryce> i saw that. good news.

21:54:42 <danbri> yes. i spoke w/ tribe.net guy at length last night.

21:54:50 <CaptSolo> zopto certainly has a nice wellpaper :)

21:55:24 <CaptSolo> danbri: can you elaborate on how they're gonna use foaf and rss?

21:55:38 <danbri> not right now

21:55:41 <danbri> sorry

21:55:41 <bryce> maybe mr. zopto will make another wallpaper, with cindy crawford next time.

21:55:47 <CaptSolo> secret stuff :>

21:56:24 <CaptSolo> bryce: the ferrari (it is ferrari?) is fine by me

22:00:50 <bryce> it just reminds me of cheesy posters on dorm room walls.

22:04:54 <Netmonger> Netmonger is now known as Netminder

22:06:17 <nym> looking for collord

22:08:50 <nym> hey mortenf

22:09:02 <mortenf> hey nym

22:09:09 <nym> have you seen collord?

22:09:17 <mortenf> nope

22:09:25 <nym> i'm in a bit of a bind

22:14:12 <CaptSolo> hi morten!

22:14:38 <mortenf> hi there

22:17:29 <danbri> bind? what's up, nym?

22:20:18 <nym> danbri : problems loading spatial data onto a postgis db

22:20:30 <nym> danbri : i think it's a permission problem

22:29:38 <mortenf> edd?

22:32:39 <edd> hi

22:32:39 * edd is very lagged, naff connection

22:33:02 <mortenf> hi, i was just curious re xmleurope feedback etc.

22:36:16 <dajobe> he's busy, wassup