Friend of a Friend (FOAF) IRC Chat Logs for 2004-09-24

01:58:18 <caro> hola

01:58:32 <caro> aqui hablan español

01:59:07 <caro> hay alguien de colombia

01:59:56 <caro> holaaaaaaaaaaaa

01:59:57 <crschmidt> Yo puedo hablar un poco de espanol

02:00:17 <caro> hola

02:00:21 <crschmidt> pero, generalmente los personas que puede habla en espanol esta en #rdfig

02:00:32 <crschmidt> yo solo tengo la espanol de la escuela :)

02:00:49 <caro> y cunatos años tienes

02:01:04 <crschmidt> Tengo viente anos

02:02:08 <crschmidt> ^query select ?nick where (?p srw:masters "es") (?p foaf:nick ?nick) using foaf for <http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/>, srw for <http://purl.org/net/inkel/rdf/schemas/lang/1.1#>

02:02:09 <julie> egyrs, Sinarmaya, Emmy, Rafa, lenna, stork, balbinus

02:02:25 <crschmidt> estas personas esta muy bueno para hablar en espanol

02:03:05 <crschmidt> si un persona "masters" espanol, La Persona puede Hablar, Leer y Escribir en este

02:03:35 <crschmidt> +idioma

02:03:57 <crschmidt> ^query select ?nick where (?p srw:speaks "es") (?p foaf:nick ?nick) using foaf for <http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/>, srw for <http://purl.org/net/inkel/rdf/schemas/lang/1.1#>

02:03:57 <julie> Query returned no results

02:04:23 <crschmidt> tiene preguntas sobre FOAF+RDF?

03:37:44 <dngor> esta is a type of verb

03:37:49 <dngor> tiene is a type of verb

03:38:07 <dngor> tengo is a type of verb

03:38:47 <dngor> (for my bot, mmhmm)

06:31:36 <mcroydon> mcroydon is now known as Netminder

08:18:48 <[GNU]> moin

09:39:27 <danbri__> peepo, see 'promoting photoblogs' in http://hoder.com/weblog/archives/011785.shtml

09:42:13 <peepo> danbri_ thanks for those, going to check into orkut too, when I get a min, I must get out more, a great evening, thanks!

09:42:44 <peepo> do let's meet up in Kirgystan, chechnya , ararat, wherever out that way

09:42:45 <danbri__> likewise. i forget how easy it is to pop down to london...

09:42:54 <danbri__> also there, yep!

09:43:15 <danbri__> re orkut, http://www.webnevesht.com/en/ is interesting chap...

09:51:51 <[GNU]> [GNU] is now known as gnu][CITY

10:11:55 <peepo> what was panjshir.org http://www.peepo.com/panjir/

10:12:44 <peepo> particularly gruesome images from http://www.rawa.org who certainly need foaf and a blogger

10:17:46 <Talliesin> RAWA are brilliant

10:18:04 <Talliesin> Do they still have hosting issues?

10:19:46 <peepo> images with sound from 2003 "stop the war" demo: http://www.peepo.com/panjir/StopTheWar5thApril2003.html

10:43:34 <danbri__> I've some 2003 demo pics linked from http://rdfweb.org/topic/WarLinks

10:44:00 <danbri__> -> http://rdfweb.org/people/danbri/media/2003/02/15/1/ also movies there

10:44:11 <danbri__> what does the word 'panjir' mean?

10:45:35 <shellac> isn't it a place?

10:45:48 <shellac> in afganistan (?)

10:46:18 <danbri__> seems to be

10:46:53 <shellac> well google thinks it is

10:47:39 <shellac> and if the cesspit of filth google uses as it's source reckons it is, it is :-)

10:48:46 * danbri__ admires peepo's pic/audio slides

14:46:49 <libby> james! morten! norm!

14:47:03 <mortenf> :) hey libby

14:47:19 <libby> afternoon :)

14:48:14 <mortenf> did you see, we've been "outed": http://kasei.us/archives/2004/09/23/image_annotation

14:48:34 <libby> now, didn;t spot that

14:48:37 <libby> no, een

14:48:42 <libby> no, even

14:48:56 <mortenf> two wrongs don't make a right...

14:49:09 <mortenf> or something

14:49:24 <libby> aw, nice form greg

14:49:30 * libby having bad spelling frioday

14:49:33 <libby> see?

14:49:41 * mortenf smiles

14:50:44 <crschmidt> That's okay, you're allowed to do that on Friday!

15:03:11 <captainjim> hey Libby

15:03:53 <captainjim> doing some groovy stuff aggregating calendars via Semaview's iCal --> RDF parser

15:04:17 <captainjim> nice work from them

15:06:26 <libby> hepup captainjim. nice :)

15:06:38 <libby> I was wondering if you guys were going that sort of thing

15:07:47 <captainjim> well we wanted to show what was going on in the community, allow for same place / same time meetings etc

15:08:22 <captainjim> plus there seem to be loads of iCal calendars out there

15:09:37 <libby> yes indeed

15:09:53 <libby> yeah, calendaring is cool

15:10:01 <libby> esp for meetings conferenecs and suchlike

15:11:02 <captainjim> i hope that there's gathering consensus for how to link to one's cal in foaf

15:11:37 <captainjim> seeAlso --> Vcalendar seems to be one way, but nothing like foaf:weblog i.e foaf:calendar

15:12:25 <libby> yeah, we've gone for the former

15:12:41 <libby> foaf:calendar might be interesting too

15:13:01 <captainjim> the former is the way we're building code around for now

15:13:43 <captainjim> though as you say foaf:calendar looks like an interesting complement of foaf:weblog

15:14:01 * ndw looks at the SimplePhotoAnnotation page and is reminded of a discussion from a few days ago with, uhm, mortenf and danbri, I think

15:14:18 <mortenf> ah, right

15:14:23 <mortenf> (hey james!)

15:14:34 <ndw> The central question was, X foaf:depicts wn:Word or X foaf:depicts [ a wn:Word ]

15:14:38 <captainjim> hey mortenf

15:15:10 <ndw> On the SimplePhotoAnnotation page, I see X foaf:depicts wn:Word, but I thought the consensus was against that.

15:15:26 <mortenf> that's a simplified syntax

15:15:41 <mortenf> the "a" is implied on nodes in the graph...

15:15:48 <libby> yeah, sorry, not super clear perhaps

15:15:51 <ndw> ah.

15:16:20 * libby fixes

15:16:53 <ndw> But in the example, it's <foaf:depicts><wn:Beer/></foaf:depicts> isn't that X foaf:depicts wn:Beer?

15:16:55 * mortenf sends another mail with that "syntax" to rdfweb-dev, should probably stop using it

15:17:16 <libby> I think it's a wn:beer

15:17:20 <mortenf> no, the typed node syntax "expands" to rdf:type

15:17:52 <mortenf> could do <foaf:depicts><rdf:Description><rdf:type rdf:resource="&wn;Beer"/></></> instead

15:18:45 <ndw> Ah.

15:19:06 * ndw sighs. There aren't enough tricky corners in XML/RDF can we invent some more, please?

15:19:24 <mortenf> sure, you do know rdf:parseType, right? ;)

15:19:38 <ndw> I think I've seen it.

15:20:11 <mortenf> <foaf:depicts rdf:parseType="Resource"><rdf:type rdf:resource="&wn;Beer"/></> is the same thing

15:22:10 <mortenf> the great thing about standards is that there are so many to choose from...

15:22:14 <Talliesin> That's a silly way to do it. Obviously you want <foaf:depicts rdf:nodeID="x"/><rdf:Description rdf:nodeID="x"><rdf:type rdf:resource="&wn;Beer"/></rdf:Description> Much clearer.

15:22:28 <mortenf> right, sorry

15:23:12 <Talliesin> Oh. Wait.

15:23:31 <Talliesin> <foaf:depicts rdf:nodeID="x"/><rdfs:Resource rdf:nodeID="x"><rdf:type rdf:resource="&wn;Beer"/></rdfs:Resource>

15:23:39 <mortenf> heh

15:24:09 <mortenf> but that's only the same to RDFS aware systems

15:24:11 <ndw> So, presumably X#beer could represent a particular glass of beer and X#Beer could represent the class of things that are glasses of beer.

15:24:37 <ndw> What's the most obvious way to express that distinction?

15:24:46 <mortenf> the #beer is an individual, #Beer is a class

15:24:59 <ndw> yeah, but the capitalization is just a hint right?

15:25:06 <mortenf> sure

15:25:11 <Talliesin> Indeed.

15:25:14 <ndw> #Beer a rdfs:Class?

15:25:30 <mortenf> yep, and then #beer a #Beer .

15:25:54 <Talliesin> But it always goes Class, predicate, Class, predicate...

15:26:13 <ndw> or #beer [ a wn:Beer ], presumably

15:26:24 <mortenf> yep, better

15:26:32 <mortenf> well...

15:26:50 <Talliesin> Except for rdf:ParseType="Resource" which is best considered as meaning there's an "invisible" rdf:Description in there.

15:26:51 <mortenf> i'm not sure about that exact syntax

15:27:21 <mortenf> (since you need a predicate between "#beer" and "["

15:27:23 <mortenf> )

15:27:34 <kpreid> namely, =

15:27:42 <Talliesin> .g striped RDF

15:27:45 <phenny> striped RDF: http://www.w3.org/2001/10/stripes/

15:27:45 <mortenf> right, that'd work in n3

15:28:00 <kpreid> but it's unnecessarily circuitous.

15:28:03 <mortenf> [ = #beer, a wn:Beer]

15:28:05 <mortenf> agreed

15:28:08 <ndw> yeah, i'm just trying to wrap my head around the graph, i'll wrestle with the syntax details later :-)

15:28:22 <kpreid> {#beer a wn:Beer} is the straightforward statement.

15:28:31 <kpreid> er, {#beer a wn:Beer.}

15:29:12 <ndw> Is that actually N3: [ = #beer, a #Beer ] ?

15:29:25 <kpreid> no, = is just a shortcut for owl:sameAs

15:29:38 <ndw> ah

15:29:40 <mortenf> ah, right

15:29:57 <mortenf> (but it's not in turtle, hence my qualification)

15:30:02 <ndw> what's "sameAs" what in that statement?

15:30:19 <gnu][CITY> gnu][CITY is now known as [GNU]

15:30:20 <mortenf> the bnode is the same as #beer

15:31:08 <kpreid> { [ = #beer; a #Beer. ] . } is shorthand for { _:a owl:sameAs #beer . _:a rdf:type #Beer . }. IIRC.

15:32:25 <kpreid> (and why am *I* explaining RDF/N3 to *ndw*?)

15:32:35 * ndw is easily confused

15:32:48 <ndw> And he's been doing depictions wrong for several years. sigh.

15:34:12 * ndw tries to see if he's got this right.

15:34:12 <mortenf> fwiw i had it wrong the exact same way in my first attempts...

15:34:49 <ndw> So, I've got xxx#thamnophis-sirtalis, that's supposed to represent the class of things that are Garter Snakes. I want to give the class an explicit URI so that I can provide other properties for it.

15:35:14 <ndw> so xxx#t-s rdf:type wn:Snake; p:uri http://... does the job, yes?

15:35:28 <ndw> (modulo whatever wacky syntax errors I've introduced)

15:36:03 <kpreid> { xxx#t-s rdf:subClassOf wn:Snake. }

15:36:09 <kpreid> er, rdfs:

15:36:11 <mortenf> what's the p:uri part?

15:36:17 <ndw> That's the other property I want to set

15:36:34 <mortenf> ah, ok, then it looks fine, for a class definition

15:36:44 <ndw> well, rdf:type or rdfs:subClassOf?

15:37:10 <mortenf> right, sorry, should be rdfs:subClassOf, otherwise you're saying it's an individual

15:37:15 <ndw> ahhhh

15:37:37 <ndw> So, for xxx#norman-walsh, the person not the class of my clones, I want rdf:type wn:Person or foaf:Person or something?

15:37:47 <kpreid> yes

15:38:01 <mortenf> yep, rdf:type foaf:Person (which is a sub class of wn:Person)

15:38:08 <balbinus_> balbinus_ is now known as balbinus

15:38:12 <ndw> hi balbinus :-)

15:38:17 <ndw> Ok, I think I've got it now.

15:38:26 <balbinus> hi ndw :)

15:38:35 * ndw goes off to fix a few things, wonders how much of the norman.walsh.name infrastructure will wind up in pieces around his ankles

15:40:00 <mortenf> :)

15:40:24 * ndw snorts. <foaf:depicts><wn:Sign_4/></foaf:depicts> has already created problems

15:40:31 <libby> :/

15:40:37 <mortenf> ok, then when you get back, we can discuss changing the lat/long stuff as per SimplePhotoAnnotation ;)

15:41:02 * ndw groans. No, I have to go to work, let's get all the pain over with at once. I've got that wrong too?

15:41:13 <mortenf> no, not wrong

15:41:31 <mortenf> just different

15:43:37 <ndw> I'm using: <dcterms:spatial rdf:parseType="Resource">

15:43:37 <ndw> <cyc:near rdf:parseType="Resource">

15:43:37 <ndw> <geo:long>-72.45</geo:long>

15:43:37 <ndw> <geo:lat>42.3382</geo:lat>

15:43:37 <ndw> </cyc:near>

15:43:38 <ndw> </dcterms:spatial>

15:43:45 <ndw> What's preferred these days :-)?

15:44:01 <mortenf> heh, that's the way i do it as well

15:44:25 <libby> maybe we shoudl just do that then! sounds like consensus to me....

15:44:45 <mortenf> but we thought that we could simplify a bit by removing the cyc:near node

15:45:24 <ndw> using cyc:SpacialThing-Localized instead?

15:45:44 <mortenf> well, that's the type (which isn't explicit in the above)

15:46:14 <mortenf> still dcterms:spatial, with coordinates on the bnode

15:46:41 <mortenf> e.g. <dcterms:spatial rdf:parseType="Resource"><geo:long>-72.45</geo:long><geo:lat>42.3382</geo:lat></dcterms:spatial>

15:46:43 <ndw> What's the description for cyc:SpacialThing-Localized

15:46:55 <mortenf> it's at the bottom of the page

15:47:09 <crschmidt> wait, geo:Point not good?

15:47:37 <mortenf> the point about the change is that it's a lot easier to query, and isn't wrong, since dcterms:spatial is quite "wide" in its definition

15:47:43 <libby> it is a geo:point, sorta

15:47:46 <libby> I think

15:48:07 <libby> geo:point is a subclass of spacialthing and specialthing-localized is a subclass of taht I think

15:48:47 <crschmidt> ah

15:49:02 * danbri still puzzling over whether foaf:Person should be a subclass of g:SpatialThing

15:49:19 <danbri> must all spatial things be somewhere?

15:49:19 * mortenf too

15:49:56 <ndw> Putting other properties on the thing labelled cyc:SpatialThing-Localized seems nicer than putting them on an untyped b-node

15:50:25 <Talliesin> must all spatial things be somewhere? I think so.

15:50:31 <libby> I think spacialthing-localized includes people (unfortunately, from our point of view)

15:50:32 <mortenf> there's a nice graph at http://www.cyc.com/cycdoc/vocab/spatial-vocab.html

15:50:44 <Talliesin> So nobody that's been cremated, or buried for a long time.

15:51:18 <antont> hm

15:52:01 <Talliesin> Or buried at sea a short time. Etc.

15:52:43 <ndw> I see cyc:SpatialThing-Localized used as the value of foaf:depicts and dc:spatial in the example. Surely one is sufficient?

15:53:16 * mortenf finds http://www.cyc.com/cycdoc/vocab/spatial-vocab.html#eventOccursNear

15:53:27 <libby> in the fulle.g. there's a slight difference in the gps coords. i.e. the camera was pointing at something a little away

15:53:37 <libby> again, not super clear

15:53:52 <ndw> Uhm,

15:53:53 <mortenf> it's the difference between where the camera and the depictee was...

15:54:39 <ndw> so dc:spatial is where the camera was, foaf:depicts is what was photographed

15:54:43 <libby> yep

15:54:46 <mortenf> yep

15:55:20 <mortenf> if e.g. you know the coords for a building in a photo...

15:55:24 <libby> I do think interesting. in one sense it maybe just that the depicts part is vaguer, e.g. a slice of galway vs a point in galway

15:55:39 <libby> (the point being where the camera is)

15:55:47 <ndw> And if you knew the GPS coordinates of the Hoary Marmot that you photographed, you'd have <foaf:depicts><cyc:SpatialThing-Localized><rdf:type rdf:resource=".../Hoary_Marmot"/>...</></>?

15:55:54 <libby> I suspect often won;t really know the depicts coord

15:56:03 <mortenf> well, yeah, that could work

15:56:32 <libby> yeah....it would...I was sorta trying to make the distinction bnetween things that move and things that don;t

15:56:33 <mortenf> but you wouldn't *need* the cyc:STL, if there are coordinates

15:56:46 <libby> (but didn;t manage it very well)

15:56:48 <mortenf> right, if that's important

15:57:14 <libby> norm, nice feedback, thanks :)

15:57:26 <mortenf> indeed thanks!

15:57:41 <libby> problem is, you can go round and round with this stuff (and we did, for about 3 guinesses)

15:58:39 <libby>http://swordfish.rdfweb.org/photos/2004/09/02/2004-09-02-Pages/Image33.html

15:59:07 <mortenf> :)

15:59:30 <ndw> Mmmmm...guiness...

16:00:02 <ndw> So, how stable are these proposals? Should I go off and implement them this weekend? :-)

16:00:30 <mortenf> i'd like for a little mailing list discussion before i get to work on it

16:01:39 <libby> yeah

16:01:48 <libby> I think not quite right yet

16:03:29 <ndw> Ok, I'll hold off for a bit. What list is the discussion taking place on?

16:03:40 <mortenf> to be decided :)

16:03:45 * ndw wrinkles his nose at the sentence that ends in a preposition that he just wrote

16:03:59 <mortenf> but likely rdfweb-dev

16:04:10 <ndw> Ok.

16:04:15 * mortenf wonders if rock, scissors, stone is possible via irc...

16:04:17 <ndw> Just wanted to make sure it was one I was on :-)

16:04:26 <Talliesin> ndw, that's something I will not up with put.

16:04:30 <ndw> lol

16:04:50 * ndw imagines a bot could help with rock, scissors, paper.

16:04:59 <Talliesin> mortenf, You can do cryptographic rock, scissors, stone. It's a simpler version of mental poker.

16:05:01 <ndw> I don't know if rock, scissors, stone would be very interesting :-)

16:05:18 <mortenf> heh

16:05:51 <balbinus> RSS only can be done w/ a trusted third party...

16:05:56 <mortenf> hmm, seems rock and stone is in the same synset in wordnet :/

16:06:15 <optika> "rock, paper, scissors", maybe? :)

16:06:27 <mortenf> better, yeah...

16:07:50 <optika> I did some interesting heads/tails things like that in a basic crypto course last year (of course, the interesting bits are finding trapdoors in weak algorithms)

16:09:49 <jsled> who wants to play? /me throws 3616d93b1153808f28cd9652d2264178

16:09:56 * ndw wanders off to work for a bit

16:11:17 <crschmidt> ^query select ?p, ?o where (?p ?o "3616d93b1153808f28cd9652d2264178")

16:11:17 <julie> Query returned no results

16:32:23 * mattb pops by

16:33:36 <crschmidt> Hey mattmcc

16:33:37 <crschmidt> er

16:33:38 <crschmidt> mattb

16:33:41 <crschmidt> too many matts!

16:33:55 <mattb> just not possible

16:34:06 <mattb> anyone putting together etcon/etech proposals today?

16:34:11 <mortenf> hi matt

16:34:20 <mortenf> no, didn't realise i should ;/

16:34:21 <mattb> hey morten

16:34:42 <mattb> monday deadline

16:34:52 <mortenf> hmm

16:34:52 <mattb> we're lookign at putting together a joint bbc one covering various bits of work

16:35:00 <mortenf> sounds interesting

16:35:05 <mattb> wondering how the foaf combo session came together last year

16:38:24 <libby> hello mattb! long time no see

16:38:43 <danbri> etech, it was more cockup than conspiracy

16:38:49 <danbri> they got lots of foaf talks proposed

16:38:58 <mattb> heh

16:39:03 <libby> from the sounds of it, quite well, even though lots of scheduled 5 mins speakers couldnt go

16:39:06 <danbri> rael accepted mine and edds squeezed into 1 session, offered the rest a lighning talk

16:39:25 <mattb> did you or he propose the squeezing?

16:39:34 <danbri> ...of course people were unwilling to fly to San Diego from Europe for 300 seconds of glory

16:39:36 <mortenf> and that's when foafcamp and foafcon were born ;)

16:39:49 <mattb> we've got a joint session that we think would work quite well, but would equally work as two 45 min sessions

16:39:53 <danbri> so edd and i rebuilt the session by recruiting new short talks during the conf

16:39:56 <mattb> otoh we're all bbc and it's all coming from the same area

16:39:57 <dajobe> I'm drafting some rdf query-based ideas

16:39:59 <danbri> he did

16:40:08 <danbri> where's etech next year?

16:40:22 <mattb> san diego

16:40:48 <danbri> daring choice

16:41:20 <mortenf> times are a'changing, oh wait...

16:42:16 <mattb> so i'm in the odd situation of working on a proposal that's not actually anything to do with rdf

16:42:23 <mattb> of course we have the other one which is rdf based

16:42:27 <mattb> so there's a balance as ever

16:42:32 <danbri> am wondering whether to do one

16:42:46 <danbri> i hate giving talks tho, and it stressed me out all thru etech last time :(

16:43:03 <mattb> i'm unlikely to go if i'm not talking

16:43:05 * mortenf is thinking of writing for xml.com

16:43:09 <mattb> since it's not really on my regular circuit

16:43:21 <mattb> but some of the oreilly crowd got quite interested in our bbc radio toys at foo

17:05:40 * mattb nips off again

18:57:27 <libby> ftf: legs and co back? ERIC PRYDZ - 'CALL ON ME'

18:57:32 <libby> wtf, even

18:57:41 <libby> bad typing friday continues

18:58:26 * mortenf doesn't understand either way...

18:59:38 <libby> I was watching top of the tops and teh number one is a remix of 'call on me'. instead of a video we get semi-clad women in legwarmers pretending to do excerises

19:00:06 <mortenf> hmm

19:00:11 <ndw> Showtime made a whole series of those back in the early eighties.

19:00:28 <mortenf> step away from the telly, get back in front of your computer...

19:00:35 <ndw> lol

19:01:17 <ndw> b-nodes in foaf:depicts turn out to be a real PITA

19:01:55 <ndw> I might have to manufacture a URI for each of them: .../what#Hoary_Marmot that is a wn:Hoary_Marmot. But that seems so...unsatisfying.

19:01:56 <mortenf> really?

19:02:16 <libby> yeah 'legs and co" were the 70s and 80s version of top of the pops

19:02:27 <libby> it's like the 90s never happened!

19:02:45 <ndw> Yeah, look at http://norman.walsh.name/2004/09/23/images/20040919-162425.html

19:02:46 * mortenf was pretty much drunk thru the 90's

19:02:50 <ndw> lol

19:03:04 <ndw> If you click on "show metadata" and look at the bottom, you'll see what I do for a depicts.

19:03:10 <mortenf> nice pic

19:03:12 <ndw> That one turns out to be right because it's me, not a class of things.

19:03:20 <ndw> Now imagine that I wanted to put in the wn:Mirrors.

19:03:36 <ndw> I'd have to do something really different instead of showing the rdf:resource on the right hand side.

19:04:04 * kpreid points to FOAF Explorer as something which displays RDF and handles bnodes

19:04:05 <mortenf> well, i'd say that uri's aren't exactly the best ui anyway

19:04:27 <libby> are here we go: http://www.bbc.co.uk/totp2/trivia/legs_and_co/

19:04:27 <mortenf> grab a label from the node instead...

19:04:28 <ndw> .g foaf explorer

19:04:31 <phenny> foaf explorer: http://xml.mfd-consult.dk/foaf/explorer/

19:04:36 <kpreid> (and it does so pretty much as RDF does - nested structures - I've never looked at the exact HTML)

19:04:42 * mortenf recommends that as well ;)

19:06:11 <mortenf> http://xml.mfd-consult.dk/foaf/explorer/?foaf=http://norman.walsh.name/2004/09/23/images/20040919-162425.rdf doesn't look too bad

19:06:28 <mortenf> if you had foaf:thumbnail in there it'd show up

19:07:00 <ndw> Hmm. I've got the thumbnails, I'll add the pointer.

19:07:28 <ndw> You want me to do real work, in other words :-)

19:07:29 <kpreid> heh, the foaf explorer doesn't include a link which is the subject

19:07:36 <mortenf> another example: http://xml.mfd-consult.dk/foaf/explorer/?foaf=http://www.wasab.dk/morten/2003/10/photos/england/3/image-74.rdf :)

19:07:40 <mortenf> of course :)

19:07:43 <kpreid> makes sense for people, but not so much for images...

19:08:04 <mortenf> right, kpreid, that's missing...

19:08:10 * ndw chuckles. ETOOMANYTRIPLES: Sorry, that URI contains too many triples (2254), unable to transform.

19:08:18 <libby> nice mortenf

19:08:20 <mortenf> hmm, i'll up it a bit

19:08:47 * kpreid suddenly realizes who made FOAF Explorer

19:08:55 <mortenf> try again

19:08:57 <ndw> Oh, that is a truely horrible photo of me

19:09:06 <libby> it's nice!

19:09:11 <mortenf> sorry :)

19:09:18 <ndw> On my 11th pint was I ?

19:09:29 * ndw chuckles

19:09:55 <ndw> Yeah, ok, do a better job with metadata.

19:10:22 <ndw> mortenf, is the source that builds your pages available for theft?

19:10:23 <mortenf> hmm, how to model how many pints had been consumed...

19:10:37 <mortenf> yep, pretty much...

19:10:49 <ndw> pointer, please? :-)

19:11:10 <mortenf> start with http://www.wasab.dk/morten/2003/10/photos/england/3/Makefile

19:11:12 <mortenf> then run...

19:11:24 <ndw> kewl

19:12:06 <mortenf> point-adder is at http://www.wasab.dk/morten/2004/09/point-adder/

19:12:17 <ndw> brb

19:12:42 * mortenf has promised to write this up a few times before, i can promise it again...

19:12:58 <libby> yeah, promise again!

19:13:08 <mortenf> ok, done :)

19:13:38 <libby> :)

19:14:00 <kpreid> isn't the topic stale?

19:14:17 <libby> yeah

19:14:20 <mortenf> it is...

19:15:17 <libby> libby has changed the topic to: IRC foaf project meeting 1630 UTC 2004-09-29 - agenda items suggestions welcomed --- Leverage your relationship assets with World Wide FOAF - http://www.foaf-project.org/ - http://rdfweb.org/ - [set your IRC client charset to Unicode/UTF-8 please!] - chat logs http://www.ilrt.bris.ac.uk/discovery/chatlogs/foaf/

19:15:20 <kpreid> kpreid has changed the topic to: Leverage your relationship assets with World Wide FOAF - http://www.foaf-project.org/ - http://rdfweb.org/ - [set your IRC client charset to Unicode/UTF-8 please!] - chat logs http://www.ilrt.bris.ac.uk/discovery/chatlogs/foaf/

19:15:27 <libby> heh mine was better

19:15:28 <mortenf> heh

19:15:30 <kpreid> oops.

19:15:54 <libby> libby has changed the topic to: IRC foaf project meeting 1630 UTC 2004-09-29 - agenda items suggestions welcomed -- Leverage your relationship assets with World Wide FOAF - http://www.foaf-project.org/ - http://rdfweb.org/ - [set your IRC client charset to Unicode/UTF-8 please!] - chat logs http://www.ilrt.bris.ac.uk/discovery/chatlogs/foaf/

19:15:56 <libby> :)

19:16:11 <libby> I was just trying to remember if aniother meeting next week

19:16:16 <kpreid> clearly we need wiki-like edit locks :)

19:18:37 <libby> libby has changed the topic to: next IRC foaf project meeting 1630 UTC 2004-09-29 - agenda items suggestions welcomed -- Leverage your relationship assets with World Wide FOAF - http://www.foaf-project.org/ - http://rdfweb.org/ - [set your IRC client charset to Unicode/UTF-8 please!] - chat logs http://www.ilrt.bris.ac.uk/discovery/chatlogs/foaf/

19:19:19 <ndw> Heh. http times out before I get a response. I think I need to trim my foaf :-)

19:19:52 <kpreid> divide into sections and crosslink with seeAlso?

19:19:57 <mortenf> hmm, i'm using the cpu for some other stuff as well atm

19:20:02 <ndw> Or just delete a few hundred bogus entries.

19:20:12 <ndw> Anyone in my Palm with an email address winds up in there :-)

19:20:49 <kpreid> as foaf:knows, or just declaring their existence?

19:21:41 <ndw> As foaf:knows, with a name and a sha1sum'd email address

19:22:03 * kpreid wonders if that ever produces too strong a claim

19:22:53 <ndw> in the sense that I have folks in my Palm that I don't really know? I suppose.

19:23:02 * kpreid nods

19:23:19 * kpreid probably produces fewer foaf:knows than he should...

19:23:24 <kpreid> (on the other hand)

19:23:40 <ndw> But if I know your email address, I probably "know" you in some sense

19:24:55 * kpreid nods

19:25:50 <libby> or at least if you bothered to put it in your palm

19:27:18 <ndw> right

19:32:29 * mortenf has an xslt that's been running for 100+ minutes now, wonder if it'll complete...

19:37:20 <balbinus> can someone tell me how to indicate the language of a literal in N3? "blah"@en?

19:37:28 <mortenf> yep

19:37:33 <balbinus> thx :)

20:42:44 <[GNU]> hi

20:43:12 <[GNU]> I'm just doing some RDF.Query() using redland... and idea how to select the xml:lang for the result?

20:44:37 <dajobe> the rdf literals you get back are redland nodes

20:44:44 <dajobe> just use the method on the node

20:45:41 <dajobe> in C it is librdf_node_get_literal_value_language

20:45:47 <dajobe> maps to various things in other langs

20:46:53 <[GNU]> hmm, i cant transfer that information to python

20:47:01 <[GNU]> i see a xml_language in the Node

20:47:06 <[GNU]> but...

20:47:23 <[GNU]> do i need to do some if xml_language == "de" ...

20:47:24 <[GNU]> ?

20:49:31 <dajobe> python http://librdf.org/docs/pydoc/RDF.html#Node

20:50:19 <dajobe> it's part of the literal_value

20:50:23 <[GNU]> hehe... thats what i am stearing at :) but give mi 3min, i think i got the idea

20:50:51 <dajobe> oops, doc doesn't actually say what the fields are

20:51:21 <[GNU]> {'datatype': None, 'string': 'Personen', 'language': 'de'}

20:51:28 <[GNU]> thats what the literal is

20:51:44 <dajobe> >>> import RDF

20:51:44 <dajobe> >>> a=RDF.Node(literal="salut",xml_language="fr")

20:51:44 <dajobe> >>> print a.literal_value

20:51:44 <dajobe> {'datatype': None, 'string': 'salut', 'language': 'fr'}

20:51:56 <dajobe> now there's an inconsistency ;)

20:52:29 <[GNU]> right, but there is no way to say "just give me back language=de literals in the nodes...

20:52:39 <dajobe> you can't do that

20:52:45 <dajobe> it's part of the rdf literal

20:52:58 <[GNU]> ok, thats fair :)

20:52:59 <dajobe> you'd have to index such things separately

20:54:17 <crschmid1> crschmid1 is now known as crschmidt

20:54:49 <[GNU]> so its like that:

20:54:49 <[GNU]> for k in result:

20:54:50 <[GNU]> if result[k].is_literal():

20:54:50 <[GNU]> if str(result[k].literal_value['language'] == 'de'):

20:54:50 <[GNU]> print str(result[k].literal_value['string'])

20:54:52 <[GNU]>

20:55:42 <[GNU]> ahm... we'r on #foaf :) sorry for that offtopicing

20:59:26 <[GNU]> thanks for now... good night

21:00:29 * dajobe makes the api consistent