Semantic Web Interest Group IRC Chat Logs for 2002-08-04

04:19:17 * lilo` looks in

04:22:27 * lilo` waves and wanders off for now

04:28:47 <automaton> ok

04:28:50 <automaton> i'm reading about this semantic web thing

04:28:52 <automaton> and i don't understand

04:28:54 <automaton> i feel stupid

04:46:20 <sbp> which bit in particular don't you get?

04:47:47 <automaton> i'm not sure. eh.. it's like, a large collection of like, statements about resources or something?

04:48:01 <automaton> and then these statements are somehow interpreted by machines/people in order to allow a more "intelligent" web?

04:48:30 <sbp> pretty much so, yes. you've done rather well to get that far, I have to say :-)

04:48:59 <automaton> just how would you go from a large collection of statements to an intelligent use of these statements?

04:49:00 <automaton> like

04:49:02 <automaton> the articles i have read

04:49:10 <automaton> have given examples of really advanced travel planning

04:49:13 <automaton> using this Semantic Web

04:49:25 <automaton> how would a computer process this so that these intelligent decisions can be made?

04:49:50 <sbp> well, it's easier (IMO) if you look at some of the smaller applications that are around now, and then imagine those scaled up

04:49:59 <sbp> for example, FOAF is a good one to read up about

04:50:04 <sbp> .google "Semantic Web" FOAF

04:50:05 <datum> "Semantic Web" FOAF: http://xmlns.com/foaf/0.1/

04:50:12 <automaton> ok

04:50:13 <automaton> thank you

04:50:15 <automaton> (very much)

04:50:33 <sbp> plenty of good links under "FOAF?" in that page to get you started

04:50:40 <sbp> but it's just one of many Semantic Web projects

04:51:02 <automaton> hrm

04:51:08 <automaton> is Semantic Web the "next big thing"?

04:52:04 <sbp> dunno. it depends whether you mean "next big buzzword", "next big thing for [company that shall remain nameless] to come in and destroy", or something else

04:52:25 <sbp> there are a lot of backers, and a lot of money being thrown at it already

04:53:20 <Guest77789> by big thing i mean important technologies. examples of big things: http, xml, relational databases, virtual memory, lisp

04:53:35 <Guest77789> Guest77789 is now known as automaton

04:54:08 <automaton> haha i ghosted myself

04:54:12 <automaton> stupid nickserv lag

04:54:15 <sbp> heh, I noticed :-)

04:54:36 <sbp> anyway, it's rather difficult to predict what will happen to the Semantic Web. but I wouldn't be working on it if I didn't think that something would come of it

04:54:57 <sbp> I often like to compare it (as many others do) to the beginnings of the World Wide Web

04:54:57 <automaton> hrm, in what capacity are you working on it?

04:55:20 <automaton> i mean, there are large numbers of people writing code, documentation, etc? or just many people waxing philosophic about it

04:55:29 <automaton> hrm

04:55:36 <sbp> check out http://infomesh.net/2001/05/sw/ Most of my Semantic Web projects are listed there

04:55:55 <sbp> there are plenty of people writing code and specifications for it! perhaps too many :-)

04:56:27 <sbp> there was (and still is) an awful lot of waxing philosophic too, though

04:57:12 <sbp> also, the SW is something which brings in people from many different fields

04:57:34 <sbp> database engineers, Web architecture experts, logicians, etc.

04:58:16 <sbp> so you get a lot of ideas, and a few flamewars... it's easy to get rat-holed

04:58:29 <sbp> this is the extremely-abstract view that I'm giving you here, BTW

04:59:30 <automaton> hrm

04:59:31 <automaton> ok

04:59:39 <automaton> thank you for pointing me in the right direction

04:59:43 <sbp> no problem

04:59:57 <sbp> all I can advise is that you read as much about it as you can possibly manage

05:00:33 <automaton> yes

05:11:31 <automaton> automaton is now known as wkh

10:28:29 * danbri tries to find a TODO-list conduit for ColdSync

10:28:40 <danbri> best I can find is http://www.coldsync.org/doc/conduits_3.html#SEC9

10:51:11 <danbri> BLURB:All I know about syncing RDF with PalmOS devices via coldsync

10:51:11 <dc_rdfig> A: All I know about syncing RDF with PalmOS devices via coldsync from danbri

10:52:49 <danbri> A:The [http://www.coldsync.org/|coldsync] site has a [http://www.coldsync.org/description.html|general intro], a list of [http://www.coldsync.org/conduits/|existing conduits] and [http://www.coldsync.org/doc/conduits_toc.html|documentation for conduit authors].

10:52:50 <dc_rdfig> Added comment A1.

10:54:30 <danbri> A:There's an [http://www.coldsync.org/doc/conduits_3.html#SEC9|example todo-dump conduit] which dumps Palm data into a text file. I need to find or write the corresponding todo-fetch code, which fetches data into PalmOS .pdb files from external source(s).

10:54:30 <dc_rdfig> Added comment A2.

10:55:23 <danbri> A:The coldsync man pages explain how the conduits get run. You reference them in your ~/.coldsyncrc configuration, and then when synch'ing they get run at the appropriate time.

10:55:23 <dc_rdfig> Added comment A3.

10:55:48 <danbri> A:A conduit is just a script that gets run with two commandline args; the string 'conduit' and then either 'fetch' or 'dump'.

10:55:48 <dc_rdfig> Added comment A4.

10:56:01 <danbri> A:That really is all I know :)

10:56:01 <dc_rdfig> Added comment A5.

10:56:30 <danbri> A:Oh, it uses the usual Perl Palm modules, plus the Coldsync.pm one that comes w/ Coldsync.

10:56:30 <dc_rdfig> Added comment A6.

16:47:04 <tav|offli> tav|offli is now known as tav

20:19:53 * DanCon wanders by, catches up, packs for Extreme Markup in Montreal

20:39:02 <DanCon> hmm... software dependency SemWeb app: "does my machine have any packages installed that have known security issues?" check local debian packages vs debian security advisories, e.g. http://www.debian.org/security/2002/dsa-141

20:46:33 <DanCon> advisories in RDF: http://www.debian.org/security/dsa.en.rdf

20:50:00 <DanCon> hmm... quacken should have a payee table, as well as accounts and categories

21:04:19 <SethR> anyone got some more rdf files ... i need data

21:09:08 <niq> SethR, what kind of data?

21:16:42 * niq has an infinite supply of RDF files

21:29:44 <DanCon> yahoo address book schema: http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/ab/impexp/impexp-09.html

21:29:53 <DanCon> (appropos of nothing...)

21:30:08 <DanCon> (well... actually, I'm sorta syncing address books before travelling)

21:58:57 <DanCon> woohoo! it worked: (1) strarted with address book exported from cell phone march 2000.

21:59:15 <DanCon> (2) read it into gnumeric for editing. (gnumeric supported the | field separator. yeah!)

21:59:43 <DanCon> (3) edited into yahoo's .csv format, moving stuff into relevant columns

21:59:48 <DanCon> (4) saved as .csv

21:59:57 <DanCon> (5) uploaded to my.yahoo.com

22:00:07 <DanCon> (6) grabbed a printable view, printed it.

22:00:39 <DanCon> note on (5): I already had a bunch of stuff in my yahoo address book.

22:01:00 <DanCon> bummer: it's 3 pages, printed, even at 2-up

22:03:47 <DanCon> BLURB: Address Book semi-automated sync

22:03:47 <dc_rdfig> B: Address Book semi-automated sync from DanCon

22:03:53 <DanCon> logger, pointer?

22:03:53 <DanCon> See http://ilrt.org/discovery/chatlogs/rdfig/2002-08-04#T22-03-53

22:04:02 <DanCon> B:see [notes|http://ilrt.org/discovery/chatlogs/rdfig/2002-08-04#T22-03-53]

22:04:02 <dc_rdfig> Added comment B1.

22:04:18 <DanCon> B:and [yahoo address book schema|http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/ab/impexp/impexp-09.html]

22:04:18 <dc_rdfig> Added comment B2.

22:05:10 <DanCon> B:other peers I use: evolution contacts. previously used: nokia cellphone, palmpilot

22:05:11 <dc_rdfig> Added comment B3.

22:06:29 <SethR> yes, but where is the rdf file?

22:07:19 <DanCon> rdf version of my palm data: /mnt/fruit0109/jammer0110/devcvs/2001/palmagent/ex-dm93/,addr-all.rdf

22:09:33 <SethR> not exactly a uri i can access

22:09:51 <DanCon> well, that's by design. I don't want you reading my address book

22:11:16 <DanCon> B:see also, earlier work: [Palm Pilot Address Book, an RDF Schema|http://www.w3.org/2000/08/palm56/addr.html]

22:11:16 <dc_rdfig> Added comment B4.

22:12:18 <DanCon> B:and [the contact schema in swap|http://www.w3.org/2000/10/swap/pim/contact]

22:12:18 <dc_rdfig> Added comment B5.

22:13:35 <DanCon> B:and [toAddrBk.py|http://www.w3.org/2000/04/maillog2rdf/toAddrBk.py], some python code to convert RDF to LDIF

22:13:35 <dc_rdfig> Added comment B6.

22:15:12 <DanCon> hmm... seems I didn't check in http://www.w3.org/2000/04/maillog2rdf/contact2ldif.n3

22:15:53 <SethR> so 2000/10/swap/pim/contact is the only schema your using here?

22:16:44 * DanCon doesn't know what to make of that question, having just given ample evidence that the answer is 'no'

22:17:55 <SethR> well its the only schema that i found but browsing from your references

22:18:17 <SethR> s/but/by

22:18:51 <DanCon> well, I'm clearly using LDIF/LDAP, the yahoo address book schema, the palm pilot address book schema, etc.

22:19:17 <SethR> where is the yahoo address book schema in rdf or n3 ?

22:19:57 <DanCon> dunno; why?

22:20:18 <SethR> i just wanted to read it into my sailor ... im hungry for data .. thats all